May 26, 2005
Children's Songs Blegging
Brian B. is kind of a twisted dude. But he reminds me of a question that Dad raised the other day in connection with his entertaining my sister's daughter:
Where did "I Know An Old Lady Who Swallowed A Fly" come from?
It's a great song to sing to kids (one of my favorites) and, with a little imagination, one can really cut loose with facial expressions, wriggling, jiggling, tickling, bouncing and props. At the same time, it is rather ghoulish, especially the final line. (I'm suddenly channelling an episode of The Muppets from way back when - the old lady was done in silhouette and at the end, if memory serves, she blew up.) Given the bubble-wrap world of modern "parenting", I'm surprised it hasn't been banned. But no, you can go to a book store and still find sing-along books, dolls and recordings.
Anyhoo, back to the question - does anybody out there know the roots of this particular song? (I ask without doing any Googling because I'd rather chat with you guys about it than do dry research.)
UPDATE: Some amazing information from Llama-friend Janeyek in the comments. Go and read. And here is the Amazon link that the Colossus dug up for the book collection, My Book House, that they're talking about. This is what I really love most about blogging.
Posted by Robert at May 26, 2005 10:47 AM*KIND* of a twisted dude?????
Sheesh, talk about damning with faint praise....
As for the origins of the tune, I dunno, I've known it since I was a jid myself. But that Muppet rendition was classic. And yes, she exploded.
Posted by: Brian B at May 26, 2005 11:10 AMHeh. That's us Llamas. Dry as dust.
As for the song, it must go back at least 40 years because I knew it back in the day, too. I believe Dad mentioned that he'd heard it earlier than that.
I was trying to remember who sang it on The Muppets, but couldn't quite. Joan Baez, I think, but I'm not sure.
Posted by: Robert the LB at May 26, 2005 11:20 AMAfter surreptitiously reading your wonderful postings for over a year now, I finally get a question that I can answer with some confidence so I don't look like a fool here among your erudite, witty, and charming respondees!
This version of the song comes from the Appalachian mountains with roots stretching back to folk tunes found in the English Isles (though there is some evidence of a cummulative song like this in the Slavic communities, but it features a nanny [goat]not a granny).
Each small settlement nestled in the mountains had its own version featuring a different array of animals but they always started with a fly and ended in the same abysmal way. There are several disc or wax recordings found in the Smithsonian archives sung by children and adults when researchers went "in the field" in the 20's and 30's to hunt down folk tunes. I also believe that there is one written version from the Lake District made when Percy Grainger was transcribing folk tunes for his compositions.
Since it is such a silly song with an impossible ending, featuring a bizarre accumulation of creatures in the story line,providing great opportunities for "acting", it is a kid favorite and in my old collection of music books, I have a copy dating from 1924.
I know that my kids (from pre-K on up) just LOVE it...as gruesome as it is!
I hope that answers the question!
janeyek
Janeyek,
Please tell us you have a blog, I know I'd love to read it. If not, then you need to start one! Good insight, much better than what I could provide.
My comment was going to be a simple "losts in the mists of time." Nursery rhymes are always ancient things, and if you start looking into them, you'll find that they are, in some form or other, far older than anyone would have guessed.
I was told on a recent trip to London that "London Bridge is Falling Down" dates from the 11th century, when the Danes attacked London. (Link below has more)
http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/encyclopedia/L/Lo/London_Bridge.htm
Janeyek - Wow! That's fantastic!
Colossus - I know there are a lot of different roots - "Ring Around the Rosie" has some associations with an epidemic, for example, although I can't remember the details off the top of my head. And I believe that "Georgie-Porgie" was originally a political shot at George the Fourth in his younger days. Fascinating stuff. I should read up on it more.
Posted by: Robert the LB at May 26, 2005 12:22 PMWow guys....thanks for the nice comments! No blog for me however, I really enjoy reading YOUR great posts (and riposts!). And I'm afraid I must confess, all my "knowledge" is just a bizarre retention of little known facts and useless trivia! However, if you EVER see this collection at a yard sale, antique store...etc...GET IT! Called "My Book House" edited by Olive Beaupre Miller published by The Children's Book House out of Chicago (my printing is from 1937), it contains some of the greatest collections of folk tales and rhymes from around the world! I have the full edition (12 volumes) and it has been such a resource in my teaching and presentations! The first two volumes are nursery rhymes and stories with some annotated foot notes that tell about the rhymes. So the plague information (Ring Around the Rosy), the Danish invasion (London Bridge) and the "plum" land grant (Georgie Porgie) are all there....the illustrations....beautiful! The Llama-ettes would really enjoy this old classic!
Enjoy gentlemen...I'm out to the garden to prepare the lavendar for making lavendar vodka and getting the lemon balm ready for lemoncella!
janeyek
Amazon has it:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/9990409455/qid=1117127640/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/102-5404283-7371309?v=glance&s=books&n=507846
Janeyek,
Amen! You need a Blog.
"And I'm afraid I must confess, all my "knowledge" is just a bizarre retention of little known facts and useless trivia!"
Ummm.... you just described about 90% of the Blogosphere.
Robert,
I too thought that "Ring Around The Rosie" was about an epidemic, specifically the Black Plague, but Snopes puts paid that idea.
Alas, I was gonna be a know-it-all till I found that.
Posted by: Brian B at May 26, 2005 01:53 PMThe "My Book House" series is excellent. I have three volumes that I bought at Goodwill several years ago because they looked interesting. I read the kids bedtime stories from them now and again. Definitely worth owning. Now I guess I need to scarf up the rest of the volumes.
Posted by: Jordana at May 26, 2005 03:15 PMYeah, yeah, Appalachians... whatever. Why did she swallow the fly?
Posted by: dorkafork at May 26, 2005 09:29 PM
